Old Photographs Saved From Trash Can ~ #84 Unknown Couple abt. 1894 (Part II)

unkcoupleUnknown Couple abt. 1894
Photo type: Cabinet Card
Card size: 4 1/4″ x 6 1/2″
Card color: cream
Card edges: plain cut, rounded corners
Border: single thin line
Front imprint: artistic gold print
Back imprint: none
Photographer: O. H. Talbott of South Side Square, Girard, Kansas
Scan: auto adjusted

After publishing last week’s post, several of my readers left comments which led to the necessity to re-think my post and write an update.

The Identity of the Man in the Photograph

My cousin Joe was the first person to comment on my post last week.

As my Mother would say “I swanee” that looks like Quincy Royalty as a young adult. Referring to the portrait taken in Kansas as well. His hair being parted on the other side might be an image reversal, but it sure looks like him.

Joe had me comparing the photo of young John Quincy Royalty (1866-1918) and checking his timeline. The photo on the left is a flipped closeup of John as Joe thought one of the two images may have been a reversed image.

royaltyquincyyoungadultunkcouple

Side by side, do they resemble each other? The identity meter on PicTriev, will compare two faces and show one of four results: from the same person, nearly from the same person, quite look-alike, and from different persons. The comparison of the above two pictures brought back from different person.

Using the similarity meter on PicTriev, I compared the above two pictures and got 78% similarity. This is more or less the same results I obtained using PicMonkey’s fade tool to compare the two overlapping photos. This was not as easy as it appears as the angle to the camera was not the same in the two photos. The positions of the mouth, nose, eyes and hairline are close matches.

mergedmen
The light looking eyes of the couple in the photo made me wonder if the soft tones were showing the true appearance of the couple. Quincy’s eyes appear much darker. If there was an image reversal, it would more likely be the couple photo as Quincy has his part on the same side when photographed in Kansas and in New Mexico.

The Identity of the Woman in the Photograph

Last week I wondered if the woman may have been the same person as the young girl on the left in this photo. The similarity meter showed 42% resemblance. Vera Marie Badertscher of Ancestors in Aprons explained this better than I could.

ireneolivecropped
Irene [surname unknown] (left) and Olive Royalty

I don’t see the resemblance to Irene. Although we can only see one ear in the younger lady, it sticks out slightly, and the woman in the top photo has small, flat-to-the-head ears. The mouth of the younger girl doesn’t look wide enough, either.

Vera brought up some good points about the younger girl and the woman not resembling each other. She also wrote:

I was really struck by what a sweet-looking young man that is. Worth tracking down. Is there a history of that county of Kansas in the late 1800’s-early 1900’s? The young man looks younger than the woman to me. She could almost be his mother.

As mentioned above, Joe thought the man may be John Quincy Royalty. He was a schoolteacher in Kansas before 1900 and there is no known marriage for him. His mother died about 1874 and his stepmother died in 1892 at the age of 62 so Vera’s theory of a mother and her son wouldn’t work.

If not mother–older sister?

Quincy had three sisters who were living around this time. Tillie, Florence, and Olive. The three were married by 1892. Could one of them have traveled to Kansas and had her photo taken with him? Could the photograph have been taken earlier? I used the similarity meter on PicTriev to compare the young woman with Quincy’s sisters.

The similarity meter on PicTriev came up with a 93% match on the young woman and Tillie and same person for the identity. The photo of Tillie (bottom) was taken about 1895. Are they the same woman?

womansmalltilliesmallJust for fun, I compared the unknown man and the unknown woman. They have an 86% resemblance according to this tool. This is even higher than the resemblance between the unknown man and Quincy. The resemblance of the woman with Florence was 66% and with Olive was 69%.

One last thought, is the brooch worn by Tillie above the same as the one worn by the unknown woman on the left? I got out both of my magnifying glasses and had a closer look. They are not the same. The unknown woman’s brooch looks almost like letters and Tillie’s is a bit larger.

magnifyingglassAre the unknown man and woman, brother and sister? Could they be John Quincy and Mathilda J. “Tillie” ROYALTY?

A Little More Help

Luanne Castle of The Family Kalamazoo made some interesting comments about the man’s collar or lack of collar.

So interesting that he wears no collar in that first pic! Would it be because he couldn’t afford a new collar and his old one was ruined or lost or something?

I thought it was more of a trend to not wear the collar.

Hmm, maybe .. . . But I know it was hard for men to get collars sometimes. They always had to budget for them.

Comments like these make me want to learn more about vintage photography and fashion of the times. Luanne has a wonderful collection of old photographs and postcards on her blog. I need to take another (closer) look at hers and mine. You see things differently when you become more interested in learning about them.

bestwishescathy1

More about this collection, how it came to be in my possession,
and links to previous posts in the series can be found here.

Please contact me!
Are you related to a person mentioned in this post? Send an email to
openingdoorsinbrickwalls @ pt.lu or message me on my Facebook page
Opening Doors in Brick Walls.

© 2017, copyright Cathy Meder-Dempsey. All rights reserved.

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Old Photographs Saved From Trash Can ~ #84 Unknown Couple abt. 1894

This photograph of an unidentified couple measures 6 1/2″ x 4 1/4″. The rich soft tones of the image are marred by a stain on the right side of the picture. At first, I thought a top layer had been scratched off of the photo. The original shows this is actually a piece of paper stuck to the picture. Very likely another photograph stuck to this one when the water damage happened.

unkcoupleoriginalscanThe front includes the photographer’s name and location in golden artistic print common around 1882-1900. The rounded corner and single line border dates this cabinet card to the 1889–1896 period. The photo was glued to a light cream colored heavy card stock and there is no writing or printing on the back.

The collar of the man’s shirt is a low band without an actual collar. His tie has a large knot and is tucked to the side as was the style in the late 19th century. His hair is cut short and neat.

The woman’s dress has a high neckline with lace, leg-of-mutton sleeves, and a wide cape-like collar bordered with black venitian lace similar to that around the neck. A pin is attached to the middle of the high neck of her blouse. Her face is framed in tiny ringlets instead of bangs while the rest of her hair appears to be put up in a bun at the back of her head.

unkcouple
Auto adjusted.

O. H. Talbott who had his business in Girard, Kansas, worked as a photographer from 1894 (or perhaps earlier) until just before 1910. No information was found for a photographer of this name. To place his occupation in Girard during a certain time period I had to draw up a short biographical sketch from information found in census records and his children’s records.

  • Othniel Henry Talbott was born in 1853 in Indiana.
  • In 1860 he was in the household of Lorenzo Dow Talbott and Elizabeth Allen, likely their oldest child, in Greencastle Ward 5, Putnam County, Indiana.
  • Sometime after 1862 and before 1866 the family moved to Iowa. In 1870 they were living in Yellow Springs, Des Moines County, Iowa.
  • In 1880 Othniel was 26 years old, single, living with his parents in Mediapolis, Des Moines County, and working as a blacksmith.
  • In 1885 when the Iowa state census was taken, he still working as a blacksmith and living in his parents’ household.
  • A change in profession and residence took place during the nine years period between 1885 and 1894.
  • Othniel married Genelia Richie about 1892 and their first child, a son, was born in January 1893 in Fairbury, Jefferson County, Nebraska.
  • In January 1894, O.H. Talbott was running advertisements in The Girard Press for his photography business.
  • In August 1894 O.H. Talbott went to Muskogee in the Indian Territory while his wife and child visited in Paola, Linn County, Kansas per a snippet in The Girard Press of August 23, 1894.
  • He must not have remained long as in 1895 they were in Paola and his parents and one of his brothers living in his household. Othniel was working as a photographer per the 1895 census.
  • In November 1897, when their 2nd son was born, the couple was still living in Paola.
  • In 1900 they were in Eldorado Springs, Cedar County, Missouri, where Othniel was working as a photographer.
  • A third son was born in September 1904 in Eldorado Springs where Othniel H. Talbott applied for a patent on 5 June 1908 for a photographic-plate holder.
  • In 1910 they were back in Potosi in Linn County, Kansas, where he was working his own mortgaged farm.
  • The 1915 state census showed Othniel, a farmer, and his wife with their two youngest sons in Potosi.
  • By 1920 the couple and their youngest son moved to Gates, Campbell County, Wyoming where land was acquired and farmed. He was still farming in 1930.
  • Othniel died in 1938 at the age of 85 and was buried in Basin. He had likely retired from farming and moved there between 1930 and his death in 1938.
  • In 1940 his widow was living in Basin, Big Horn County, Wyoming, with their son youngest son, daughter-in-law, and granddaughter.
  • His wife who was 19 years younger, died in 1954 and was buried beside him.

Since this sketch points to O.H. Talbott doing business in Girard, Kansas, in January 1894 and until August of the same year, I wonder if his business in the town may not have gotten off to a good start. Paola is 73 miles north of Girard and I do not believe Othniel would have commuted to work. It is more than likely his business in Girard was short lived and this photograph may be one of very few, if any, which survives.

youngoliveThere is another photograph in this collection which was taken in Girard at Bell’s Studio in the early 1880s. It was featured in Old Photographs Saved From Trash Can ~ #18 Olive ROYALTY 1871-1949 and shows a young Olive (right) and another girl who was only identified as Irene (left). How Olive came to be in Girard to have her portrait taken with Irene is unknown. Could Olive’s friend Irene be a younger version of this young woman with the man? When comparing the two photographs the difference in the color of the eyes stands out. Could the soft tones of the photo taken by Talbott cause the young woman’s eyes to appear lighter? Can a resemblance be found between the young woman and Irene?

bestwishescathy1

More about this collection, how it came to be in my possession,
and links to previous posts in the series can be found here.

Please contact me!
Are you related to a person mentioned in this post? Send an email to
openingdoorsinbrickwalls @ pt.lu or message me on my Facebook page
Opening Doors in Brick Walls.

© 2016, copyright Cathy Meder-Dempsey. All rights reserved.

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Old Photographs Saved From Trash Can ~ #17 John Quincy ROYALTY 1866-1918

This is a spin-off of my 52 Ancestors: #14 Albert Spencer LILLIE (1848-1913) ~ Old Photographs Saved From Trash Can blogpost in which I featured a few photos from a collection of old photographs my 4C1R Joe Rooney shared with me. I asked Joe about using the photos and he kindly wrote, Please use them at your will.  I feel it is keeping it in the family and don’t need credit.  If anything, I appreciate your evaluations, identifications and detective work.  I’m hopeful you and yours enjoy them.  On a blog, in a book, above a cloud.”

Please contact me!
Are you related to a person mentioned in this post? Send an email to
openingdoorsinbrickwalls @ pt.lu or message me on my Facebook page
Opening Doors in Brick Walls.

Links to previous posts in this series may be found in Old Photographs

#17 John Quincy ROYALTY 1866-1918

John Quincy ROYALTY was the third son of Samuel L. ROYALTY and Joanna PALMER. He never married.

john
A young John Quincy ROYALTY during his days as a schoolmaster in Kansas.

During his earlier years John was a schoolmaster in Kansas and Missouri. Later he became a detective and, according to his obituary, was a trusted employee of a leading firm doing this sort of work. His duties took him to various places in the West and he resided at times in Colorado, New Mexico and California.

In 1898 while in Albuquerque, New Mexico, he enlisted in Company E, First Territorial U.S. Volunteer Infantry, and served during the Spanish War until mustered out at Albany, Georgia, in 1899.[1] Officially designated as the First Territorial Volunteer Infantry, the regiment became known as the “Western Regiment;” the “Big Four” from the four territories: Arizona, New Mexico, Oklahoma, and Indian Territory; or “McCord’s Infantry.”

johnstanding
John Quincy ROYALTY in Albuquerque, New Mexico.

After a visit to his old home in Pope County, Illinois, he returned to the West. In 1900 he was once again in Albuquerque, living in the household of his brother-in-law John R. BOSWELL and his youngest sister Olive ROYALTY, and working as a watchman for the railroad.

By 1903 he became a resident of Los Angeles, California. He was working as a watchman on patrol per the 1910 census.

“While employed as private watchman during Nov. 1917, he suffered an attack of acute appendicitis, and in spire (sic) of heroic efforts of the surgeons during a prolonged illness, complications arose, and his weakened vitality at last succumbed to death.”[2]

lyinginstate
John Quincy ROYALTY, lying in state.

Sources:
[1] “United States Index to Service Records, War with Spain, 1898,” Database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QK7J-YKK8 : accessed 26 June 2015), John Q Royalty, 1898; citing NARA microfilm publication M871 (Washington, D.C.: National Archives and Records Administration, n.d.); FHL microfilm .
[2] “Pedigree Resource File,” database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/2:2:3W51-L4J : accessed 2015-06-26), entry for John Quincy /Royaltey/, Submission ID MMDF-H5K.

Joe Rooney kindly gave me permission to use these photographs on my blog.

Joe ROONEY wrote on 15 February 2015: This collection of photographs was scanned at 300 dpi color by me. The original photos were sent by Sandra Lillie about ten years ago after she found them cleaning out a relative’s garage in Southern Illinois, finding no other takers (suckers). She believes they were a collection by L Vance Lillie. Many of the pictures seemed to be removed from frames or were in albums evidenced by fading characteristics and may have been from other’s collections. I scanned the reverse if there was laboratory advertising or writing. Some of the authors’ identification may be figured out of the handwriting matches. I did not scan the reverse of photos where there was only a three digit number that I believe to be sequence numbers on a roll of film. I didn’t spot any obvious helpful commonalities.

© 2015 Cathy Meder-Dempsey

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